tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6940163880772720830.post1212672762246493693..comments2024-03-16T10:11:19.302-07:00Comments on Cold Thistle: The shell game? But in this case we are discussing insulation.Danehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08300760603627210620noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6940163880772720830.post-83587810584709368402016-01-23T14:41:23.651-08:002016-01-23T14:41:23.651-08:00I found the Mountain Hardwear PR site
http://mou...I found the Mountain Hardwear PR site <br /><br />http://mountainhardwear-pr.houglandia.com/<br /><br />You can grab press kits and see details about new products at that site. You can also download "tech sheets" for their various technologies. Full warning, these are not very "technical" so I wouldn't expect much new info, but it does confirm that they are claiming %20 better than their "nearest competitor" for Thermal Q Elite and that they are saying they are "ounce for ounce, the warmest synthetic ever made." You can the Thermal q elite tech sheet here http://www.mountainhardwear-pr.houglandia.com/assets/MHW_ThermalQElite.pdf<br /><br />I picked up a 100 g/m2 insulated Super Compressor jacket for around $150 to test. It is warm, I'll give it that, but I really wish there was an industry standard for rating these jackets similar to the way sleeping bags are tested. The problem is that standardization would benefit the consumer not the vendor, so chances are slim that it will ever happen. My guess is that there is some serious fuzzy legality in the way that MH is claiming to be "the warmest synthetic ever made." <br /><br />From the tech sheet <br /><br />"Thermal.Q Elite sets a new standard for synthetic<br />insulation, significantly warmer than the leading<br />synthetic insulation at both 100 gram and 60 gram<br />weights. Test results from independent laboratories<br />have show that both the raw insulation and complete<br />Thermal.Q Elite garments retain warmth more<br />efficiently than any other synthetic. "<br /><br />I wonder what it would take to get ahold of of those independent tests. I also wonder why the CLO per/oz is much worse for the 60g (.694) weight vs the 100g <br />(.85) weight. I wonder if this is true for Primaloft as well, but we'd never know since we don't know at what weight they are testing. <br /><br />If you look at this video, https://vimeo.com/58284542 the MH guy says that the industry standard at 100g is generally 2.5 to 2.7 ish clo. That maxes out at about .76 clo/oz. Further, he then says that Thermal Q elite gets above a CLO of 3 at 100g. The math here doesn't add up and I don't see where they are getting their 20% claim as 20% better than .76 would put them at almost .92 (which doesn't match either of the values in the tech sheet). <br /><br />Further, check this thread http://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/76982/ there is a scan of a magizine advertisement where they specifically claim 35% better than primaloft one in the 60g/m2 weight. <br /><br />Basically this all boils down to a mess for the consumer. We do not have the ability to make an informed decision prior to purchase. Someone with more pull than I have needs to bust some balls to get these guys to start providing better data so we can make informed decisions with our hard earned cash. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08837699640492618476noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6940163880772720830.post-72749723891020930972016-01-15T23:44:07.500-08:002016-01-15T23:44:07.500-08:00The quasar insulated jacket looks interesting; dry...The quasar insulated jacket looks interesting; dry q membrane with 80g insulation. Should be waterproof, windproof and reasonably warm. Also can be had for around $180 if you look hard enough (check Sierra Trading Post). I'm tempted to pick one up just because that seems like a lot of jacket for not much cash. Of course fit is everything, and MH jackets always seem to run a bit big/boxy on me, so it could be a bust. <br /><br />If it isn't a bust, it would be a product very similar to a nuclei AR at about 1/2 price. The dead bird appears to be nicer in every way that matters, but $200 in my pocket isn't something to take lightly. For the price of the new nuclei AR you can pick up an 80g quasar and have almost enough left over for a DAS on closeout if you like that sort of thing. <br /><br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08837699640492618476noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6940163880772720830.post-19302384392472884022016-01-15T23:23:12.164-08:002016-01-15T23:23:12.164-08:00Hi Nathan, Good stuff, thanks.
I have not used t...Hi Nathan, Good stuff, thanks. <br />I have not used the MH products you mention.Danehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08300760603627210620noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6940163880772720830.post-7109215796080363992016-01-15T23:16:15.426-08:002016-01-15T23:16:15.426-08:00Dane,
See this data sheet. http://www.mountainhard...Dane,<br />See this data sheet. http://www.mountainhardwear-pr.houglandia.com/assets/MHW_ThermalQElite.pdf<br /><br />By my math that makes thermal q elite about .85 clo/oz<br /><br />This is a respectable figure, probably close to coreloft, but one wonders where they figure they are 20% warmer than primaloft gold. <br /><br />On the topic of MH, ever used either a super compressor or a quasar insulated jacket? <br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08837699640492618476noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6940163880772720830.post-22744934772841155282015-11-24T20:39:42.356-08:002015-11-24T20:39:42.356-08:00I've been using the original version to the Nu...I've been using the original version to the Nuclei for a while now (two seasons). Nice enough piece of insulation. The AR version should be even better.Danehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08300760603627210620noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6940163880772720830.post-4650064575959735672015-11-24T19:02:30.271-08:002015-11-24T19:02:30.271-08:00Any thoughts on the new Arc'teryx Nuclei AR?
...Any thoughts on the new Arc'teryx Nuclei AR?<br /><br />Also, I think Thermatek is DWR treated Climashield Prism. http://climashield.com/shop-outdoorAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com